Watch humour...

Aquagraph
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Materials yes, and I agree with you on the probably actual cost to make... but given they need to test water resistance etc, won't there be R&D costs? Plus, with the Monaco there's the whole issue of the left hand crown, which doesn't seem likely with a Heuer 02. So should they use ETA/Sellita?
 
Yago
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I don’t see a lot of Breitlings and Hamiltons with left hand crowns and no one seems to care. These are nice for heritage re-editions but not necessary for the standard range.
 
Yago
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The Heuer02 was probably a bad decision in hindsight. Great movement but big and loud. Do we need that many automatics? Hamilton are selling tons of their lauded hand wound calibres and the Speedy is still hand wound.
 
McBeardy
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Visually for me the left hand crown and horizontal indices on the Monaco are more balanced, (the right design ethos) right hand crown on that square cases looks off IMHO. Now I'm not one for 1:1 copies or reissues I believe their should be a high % of retro-ness (call it) but with modern details/ materials/ movements. I for one would love a H02 left hand crown Monaco, nice metallic. sun ray blue dial and 14mm thick. Or a 42mm Panerai 372 - unfortunately dont think either will ever be made.

Regarding Omega and the Speedy - I doubt if that watch didnt go to the moon (& be Omega's go to seller) it would be either still around or a 1:1 copy.

Let's be honest they make a modern auto version - but my guess it just doesnt sell like the other. Even the 'Bond' Seamaster has altered it's image more than a teenager!

I guess only Rolex doesnt really update it's lineage that drastically. Maybe the Daytona giving the new ones compared to the Newman ones. Rolex just update modern materials (they use Tudor as the alter ego/ fresh ideas - even thats now stuck with the BB range - and how it can advance from this watch).

As for sizes well across the board most major (top 5/6 brands) have increased their case sizes, whilst we are not at the size of the macho Pams and Breitlings, they have increased.

As for brands appealing to WIS, they are a business, majority of them successful and have tons of research on what sells and who too, we are not their target market unfortunately, as much as we want to be.
 
McBeardy
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Yago Yago
The Heuer02 was probably a bad decision in hindsight. Great movement but big and loud. Do we need that many automatics? Hamilton are selling tons of their lauded hand wound calibres and the Speedy is still hand wound.

Hamiltons surely just for their VFM point, also be nice to see is that WIS buying hand wind or general consumers?

Speedy only because they have to, if it wasnt for its history (& let's be honest probably mans finest achievement - especially with the romanticism with the watch) I reckon it woudve have been dropped. Omega like to innovate after all
 
Aquagraph
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The Speedy is always brought up as the perfect example of a watch that has remained constant through time. I really don't know much about Omega at all (and never pretended otherwise), but if this is true, then surely in its day the Speedy was a big ass watch... right? I tried a Speedy on about three years ago and while I found it dull, it certainly didn't strike me as either 'vintage' or 'small', maybe if the original Carrera was a proper size instead of 36mm then there would be less trouble now? 😁
Edited:
 
imagwai
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Aquagraph Aquagraph
The Speedy is always brought up as the perfect example of a watch that has remained constant through time. I really don't know much about Omega at all (and never pretended otherwise), but if this is true, then surely in its day the Speedy was a big ass watch... right? I tried a Speedy on about three years ago and while I found it dull, it certainly didn't strike me as either 'vintage' or 'small', maybe if the original Carrera was a proper size instead of 36mm then there would be less trouble now?
The Carrera was always intended as a more elegant and simple Chronograph. But it wasn't too out of keeping with other offerings from other brands, including Omega. The Speedmaster was originally intended as a racing chrono I think. And Heuer produced larger chronos too, e.g. Autavia and the later Carreras. But a lot of people seem to agree that Jack Heuer got it pretty right with the 36mm Carrera design.
 
Aquagraph
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Okay, but I am confused because all we hear is that watches are too big and were smaller in the good old days, and yet it seems like the Speedy has always been 42mm? Or is that not the case?
 
imagwai
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Aquagraph Aquagraph
Okay, but I am confused because all we hear is that watches are too big and were smaller in the good old days, and yet it seems like the Speedy has always been 42mm? Or is that not the case?
Yes, it has, and it was certainly on the larger side I guess in those days. But there's more to how a watch wears than just the diameter. The Speedy is not too chunky, at least a mm or two of the diameter is due to the crown guards, and the lug to lug is manageable for smaller wrists. On average, I think it's true to say that watches were certainly smaller back then, but that doesn't necessarily hold for every single watch. The Navitimer is another example of one that was actually designed to be larger. But form tended to follow function rather than fashion a bit more I think (plus there was kudos attached to making movements and cases smaller and more wearble).
 
Aquagraph
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Maybe one of the reasons the Speedy doesn't seem dated is because it is bigger?
 
paysdoufs
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LOL 😁

@Aquagraph : I think with respect to Omega and the Moonwatch, the size discussion is a bit misleading since Omega has always had a knack for making watches that “read large” on paper very wearable.

With respect to vintage Heuer that same discussion is IMHO even totally pointless because literally ALL Cal.11/12 icons have sizes that could be transposed 1:1 to today and would be perfectly wearable. Some would be on the smaller and some others on the larger side of their market segment, but all would still look perfectly contemporary as far as size is concerned.
 
Mspeedster
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paysdoufs paysdoufs
With respect to vintage Heuer that same discussion is IMHO even totally pointless because literally ALL Cal.11/12 icons have sizes that could be transposed 1:1 to today and would be perfectly wearable. Some would be on the smaller and some others on the larger side of their market segment, but all would still look perfectly contemporary as far as size is concerned.
Yes the original vintage C11 & C12 Heuer Monacos were around 40-41.5mm horizontal x 38mm vertical, making them more of a rectangle than square. They were also pretty thick at around 14mm. Hence the overall size is similar to the modern day Monaco.

I feel the current C11 McQueen is a fitting reissue, I only wish it had the round pushers.
 
dtf
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Mspeedster Mspeedster
I've never moaned once about them being 39mm.

unless the 39mm refers to the thickness, then I moan about it.
 
Aquagraph
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So it turns out the whole 'vintage watches were smaller' schtick isn't quite true then...
 
Mspeedster
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Aquagraph Aquagraph
So it turns out the whole 'vintage watches were smaller' schtick isn't quite true then...
Depends on the watch.

In the case of the Monaco, yeah not so true. The 1163 Autavias of the 70s (Siffert, Viceroy, Orange Boy etc.) are also not small and the cushion case makes them feel even bigger to me than their 42mm size.

But the manual wind Autavias (e.g. Rindt, Andretti) and Carreras of the 60s are definitely smaller than their modern day counterparts.
 
Yago
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Aquagraph Aquagraph
So it turns out the whole 'vintage watches were smaller' schtick isn't quite true then...
They were, just not sports watches. Try finding a 39mm dress watch from the ‘60s or ‘70s. Breitling top time and Carrera of the 60s were barely 36mm, in tune with most men’s dress watches of that era. Sports watches were usually bigger. Submariner Speedy, Navitimer. Heuer caught up late ‘60s, early ‘70s with the Chronomatics. 1153 Carrera was big at the time but on the small side today. 1163 Autavia, certainly 11630 were huge at the time. From ‘72 it got crazy with the Montreal among others.
 
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