The Ayrton Senna x TAG Heuer Appreciation Thread

Thehighwayman
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At least there isn't as much mystery around his Honda as his Merc's !
Cool shots !

Stumbled on this nice early interview from the BBC archives the other day,never seen it before.
He's wearing his Seiko too .
 
Geert Jaeken
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So I finally received the January 1986 issue of Sport Auto. There is a two page Senna interview focusing mainly on his 1985 season and his rise to stardom, some questions on his 1986 teammate (this was the time of the Warwick controversy and Lotus still had to decide on Senna's teammate. The magazine reports in a separate article on pre-season testing that Senna was pushing Lotus to sign Mauricio Gugelmin), a question on his interest of driving for Ferrari and finally a question on life in the UK as a Brazilian.

No additional info on why Senna was in Stuttgart, in a sidebar it is mentioned that 'Senna drives a Lotus Renault as a company car, but prefers a 190E 2.3-16 as his private car'. It shows him with the 'mysterious' black 190E 2.3-16.

Based on all info assembled:

  • During his time in the beginning in the 80's, Senna drove an Alfasud which was replaced by a Ford Escort XR3 (pictures in front of his Esher house available on the web) and a Renault (according to an interview with Mauricio Gugelmin which I found on-line).
  • In 1984 he bought a Mercedes-Benz 500 SEC, of which he took delivery in October 1984 at the Sindelfingen plant in Stuttgart. This car is still in existence and was displayed a couple years ago at Mercedes-Benz World in Brooklands. A full history of this car can be found in the June 2017 issue of Mercedes Enthusiast. According to this article, Senna owned the car for almost two years. (Here is a link to the article - https://theknifeandme.wordpress.com...of-taste-and-distinction-a-continuing-series/)
  • One year after the 500 SEC, Senna bought the smoke silver 190E 2.3-16 (October 1985). One the website of RM Sotheby's, you can retrieve almost all original paperwork of this purchase. The original invoice confirms that Senna bought the car (and didn't receive it as a price for his win), albeit with a healthy discount (20%) and a direct delivery at the Sindelfingen plant in Stuttgart. The dates on all relevant documents are October 1985.
  • The Sport Auto interview makes reference to and reviews the complete 1985 season thus ruling out the June 1985 date as documented by the Mercedes-Benz archives. It confirms that Senna was in Stuttgart (to take delivery of his smoke grey 190E 2.3-16) and the promotional film was probably taken at the same time. I can confirm that the film was shot at the (old) Hockenheim circuit which is situated at roughly a one hour drive from Stuttgart. Strangely, in the book 'Racing for Mercedes-Benz' by Hartmut Lehbrink (a book on 240 drivers that have competed for Mercedes-Benz Motorsport), Senna is also mentioned (although he never officially raced for Mercedes-Benz) courtesy of the 1984 celebrity race and the book also mentions that Senna 'called the factory in June 1985 himself to collect his car'. I guess the author just trusted the Mercedes-Benz archive without any additional research...
  • I think that all previous assumptions on the black 190E 2.3-16 car on the picture is correct: I think this is indeed one of the two 'Lotus company cars'. WB & Sons auctioned one of these cars in 2023 and they confirm a delivery at the Stuttgart Sindelfingen plant in October 1985 and a first registration in the UK in January 1986.
  • Senna drove another Mercedes-Benz at the same time in Brazil: a dark blue 300 TE estate car (S124) which is featured in the briliant 'The lifestyle of Senna in Brazil' documentary as Senna's 'practical car'. Senna's girlfriend Adriane Yamin also talks extensively about this car in her book 'My Girl': Senna imported the car himself to Brazil and the couple had many memories in it. Sadly the car is destroyed: according to Adriane in an accident, athough there ate also (unverified) articles on-line about this car being prepared for a museum but destroyed as a result of an arson in the warehouse where it was stored amongst other Brazilian celebrity cars.
  • Finally, there is also a Mercedes-Benz 600SL (R129) which was acquired by Senna somewhere between 1992 and1993 and spend some time in a small museum. This car was flooded at some time but seems to be restored by FuelTech motorsports and remains in Brazil.

Although it isn't really watch or Tag Heuer related, I hope you enjoy Senna's car history. Let me know if you want some info on Senna's Audi (his final road car... ;-)).

Senna_Merc3.webp
 
Thehighwayman
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Fabulous information Geert!
Personally, I'm 100% with you in the assumption the black Mercedes is one of the Lotus pool cars.

Very interesting to read he drove an Alfasud and an XR3, that I did not know. I owned one of each of those myself many years ago, so of particular interest! I preferred the Alfa although the XR3i had marginally less problems with rampant corrosion !
 
Mspeedster
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Thank you very much for the follow-up @Geert Jaeken!

Unless a black 190e 16v surfaces with a confirmed registration history as Senna's, the only 16v we can be sure of is his smoke silver one. But it's easy to see why so many believe he also owned the black one.
 
Albert-AMG
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Made with 400.000 Lego pieces for the 2024 Monza F1 GP 😍

IMG_1229.webp IMG_1231.webp
 
Mspeedster
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Here's a couple of Senna's mystery watches that I've been trying to identify for a while but have me stumped. As @Thehighwayman seems to have a wide range of knowledge on a variety of brands, I thought I'd share these with the forum to get more ideas.

Judging by the look of Senna's age and hair style, I think these were taken during the time he was sponsored by TAG Heuer. But I do not believe the first photo (eating pasta) or the second photo of what seems like a black PVD watch are TAG Heuers.
IMG_0620.webp IMG_0569.webp

This other watch being worn while playing tennis I thought might be a TAG Heuer 2000. But the case shape doesn't look quite right, and it also has these odd pushers that I don't think I've seen on any 2000.
Senna tennis1.webp Senna Tennis Monte Carlo Tennis Club 1991 July 10th.webp

Any thoughts?
 
Thehighwayman
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Nothing like giving a guy the big build up for a bit of pressure ! 🤣
Number 1 is a struggle,looks very thin. Notably thin 80's/90's watches from Audemars Piguet or perhaps something with a Longines L990 movement would be possibles that spring to mind.
Number 2,looks impossible. My first thought was something in a plastic or fibre case as the crown appears to be chrome and there are no reflections off the case or bracelet at all.
Number 3 looks frustratingly familiar to me but I haven't placed it yet.First thought was possibly an Omega X33 or a Breitling Navitimer Jupiter ana/digi but it's neither. I have a hunch it may be a Seiko with left hand pushers.Possibly something 7T32 based like the one below or more likely an ana/digi such as the H601 8060 Sports pictured below that.
I'll keep working on it !

31be0ef0-b827-11e4-9170-3dd2ddb6b986.webp FullSizeRender_92c6c5f6-4f9f-48e5-bf96-8e50c193c5bc_1024x1024@2x.webp

In fact I think that may be the one,see in this shot below how the crown on these is below 3 but not at 4,quite unique and matches I think.
My only concern is I can't see the upper left pusher,I can see a hint of something possibly but low re can play tricks !
The upper pusher is less prominent so may be there and partially covered by the bezel if it was rotated..
OIP.webp
Edited:
 
Mspeedster
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blow up.webp

Thanks @Thehighwayman. No pressure, just looking for fresh ideas. I know the pictures are not the best, making it very difficult to get a positive ID. I've enlarged Senna's tennis watch and rotated 180. It looks close to those Seikos, but the pushers seemed to be in slightly different positions and I can't really see a 3rd pusher on his. I also think the lugs on Ayrton's watch look slightly longer in comparison.
 
Thehighwayman
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Mspeedster Mspeedster
blow up.webp

Thanks @Thehighwayman. No pressure, just looking for fresh ideas. I know the pictures are not the best, making it very difficult to get a positive ID. I've enlarged Senna's tennis watch and rotated 180. It looks close to those Seikos, but the pushers seemed to be in slightly different positions and I can't really see a 3rd pusher on his. I also think the lugs on Ayrton's watch look slightly longer in comparison.
No worries,only said in jest !
I like a good mystery to solve !

I'm fairly convinced it's an ana/digi and unless it has a recessed crown that must be the crown on the right. It looks too high for a pusher I think anyway.
If it is the crown it's not at 4 but lower than three,the Seiko 601 movement is the only one with that layout I think.There are a number of other 601 powered Seiko's so i'll have a search through tomorrow.The lugs do look a touch longer but I think that's the angle of the shot,if the image of the one I posted was tilted in the same way the downslope on the lugs becomes more prominent and it visually lengthens them.
The second tennis shot is the most useful I think,there seems to be some distortion in the first.

The missing pusher is also my main concern and that's a puzzle.

If it is a 601 the period is correct,the tennis photos are 91 I think ? The Seiko's came out late 80's.
 
Mspeedster
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Thehighwayman Thehighwayman
No worries,only said in jest !
I like a good mystery to solve !

I'm fairly convinced it's an ana/digi and unless it has a recessed crown that must be the crown on the right. It looks too high for a pusher I think anyway.
If it is the crown it's not at 4 but lower than three,the Seiko 601 movement is the only one with that layout I think.There are a number of other 601 powered Seiko's so i'll have a search through tomorrow.The lugs do look a touch longer but I think that's the angle of the shot,if the image of the one I posted was tilted in the same way the downslope on the lugs becomes more prominent and it visually lengthens them.
The second tennis shot is the most useful I think,there seems to be some distortion in the first.

The missing pusher is also my main concern and that's a puzzle.

If it is a 601 the period is correct,the tennis photos are 91 I think ? The Seiko's came out late 80's.
Yes, the tennis photo is from 1991, taken at the Monte Carlo Tennis club. Thanks, this gives me something to go on, if I can find a better picture at some point. 🍻
 
Mspeedster
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On a related note, I was able to find a pretty clear picture of Senna's Longines, which was a previous mystery watch discussed earlier in this thread about a year or so ago. This photo leaves little doubt in my mind that it was IDed correctly as the Longines Conquest Titanium moonphase 4983.
Senna Portugal 87 Longines Conquest Titanium Moonphase 4983.webp
 
Thehighwayman
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Mspeedster Mspeedster
On a related note, I was able to find a pretty clear picture of Senna's Longines, which was a previous mystery watch discussed earlier in this thread about a year or so ago. This photo leaves little doubt in my mind that it was IDed correctly as the Longines Conquest Titanium moonphase 4983.
Senna Portugal 87 Longines Conquest Titanium Moonphase 4983.webp
Yes, I saw that one discussed when I read through the thread. I have a Longines Conquest Las Vegas auto with the same case shape and integrated NSA bracelet, I recognised that one!

I'll do some more research on the tennis watch. It's possible it doesnt have a crown and both those are pushers. I'm thinking a recessed button for electronic hand setting if thats the case.
I'm fairly confident there are enough clues to nail it.
 
Thehighwayman
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Another company that was big on angular ana digi watches at that time was Yema, some similar but not as close as that Seiko.
A Swiss movement with a single pusher on the left would be an ESA 900.231 but they also have a right pusher quite close to the crown.
 
Mspeedster
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Thehighwayman Thehighwayman
I'll do some more research on the tennis watch. It's possible it doesnt have a crown and both those are pushers. I'm thinking a recessed button for electronic hand setting if thats the case.
I'm fairly confident there are enough clues to nail it.
Perhaps more clues from this pic of the tennis watch from a different angle.
IMG_0624.webp IMG_0625.webp
 
Thehighwayman
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Mspeedster Mspeedster
Perhaps more clues from this pic of the tennis watch from a different angle.
IMG_0624.webp IMG_0625.webp
More questions than answers from that one I think 🤔
I've not got closer than that Seiko 601 so far.If it was just one photo with an invisible pusher I'd be inclined to think it was just pushed into the skin on the wrist a bit, part covered with arm hair and not picking up the light. Not visible on either shot though.
 
Mspeedster
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Thehighwayman Thehighwayman
More questions than answers from that one I think 🤔
I've not got closer than that Seiko 601 so far.If it was just one photo with an invisible pusher I'd be inclined to think it was just pushed into the skin on the wrist a bit, part covered with arm hair and not picking up the light. Not visible on either shot though.
Do you have any shots of those Seikos you shared from a similar angle showing the sides? The outside of the lugs on Senna's has what appears to be some kind of notch in it, which seems rather unique. If the Seikos you're thinking of doesn't have that lug design, it may rule them out.
1966582-30ced67581ce34119699bf3f304111fc.webp
 
Watchmen_DR
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Sooooo I spied this on Tag’s main website. Appears to beeee a new Senna done in the whole 44mm titanium thing they’re doing with the F1 chronos

IMG_1510.webp
 
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