JLC Master Mariner HLC Thrift Store Find, Info Sought

Posts
118
Likes
202
I'm a regular thrifter and came across this today. This was a total surprise! The store clearly Googled and has an (imo) aspirational price, though I hope to haggle. It was a price where I wasn't comfortable purchasing without doing any homework.

I've been researching and gather this is a Master Mariner HPC, ref. 9514, linen dial with onyx indices. Appears it should have a Cal. 164. I found photos from an old listing of the watch (the photo with the watch on wrist is the reference image I'm using. The hands, indices and text on the dial all seem correct, to me. The crystal is obviously cracked and won't know the service history so it would be a gamble. Watch was running.

I'd like to find more information about the specific reference, and check if the information above is accurate. I also have some questions, like what does HPC stand for? Are the crystals tough to replace? Any red flags I should be aware of with Cal. 164? Were they popular in their day or today? I dig the case shape, it screams 70s to me. @gatorcpa if you have images of the watch from a JLC catalogue, I'd appreciate the help!

 
Posts
13,095
Likes
17,950
No catalogs from that era, but found some info about the cal. 164 movement, which was made for LeCoultre by A Schlid.

https://www.emmywatch.com/db/movement/jaeger_lecoultre--164/

https://www.watchprosite.com/editor...s-correct-or-reassembled-/2.1526711.14825211/

36,000 bph movements are both a blessing and a curse. When running right, they tend to be very accurate. But when something goes wrong, they are difficult to service and because they weren’t made in large numbers, parts can be problematic.

Proper maintenance is key with these.
gatorcpa
 
Posts
118
Likes
202
No catalogs from that era, but found some info about the cal. 164 movement, which was made for LeCoultre by A Schlid.

https://www.emmywatch.com/db/movement/jaeger_lecoultre--164/

https://www.watchprosite.com/editor...s-correct-or-reassembled-/2.1526711.14825211/

36,000 bpm movements are both a blessing and a curse. When running right, they tend to be very accurate. But when something goes wrong, they are difficult to service and because they weren’t made in large numbers, parts can be problematic.

Proper maintenance is key with these.
gatorcpa
thanks so much! appreciate it.
 
Posts
13,095
Likes
17,950
You state in your original post that the price was "aspirational". I have no idea what that means.

My caveat there is that from a collector's standpoint, these A Schlid movements are not as highly regarded as the in-house movements made in the JLC factory. Given that the exterior of the watch has been heavily polished, it's going to need a service and a non-JLC made movement, I would not pay too much for this watch.

gatorcpa
 
Posts
15,187
Likes
44,610
28,800 or 36,000 hertz refers to beats per HOUR, not beats per minute!
 
Posts
13,095
Likes
17,950
Yes. My bad. I will correct now.
gatorcpa
 
Posts
118
Likes
202
Here is your answer on "HPG"


https://www.watchprosite.com/jaeger-lecoultre/well-done-sherlock-but-/2.1526711.14826926/

Also, it seems that the Cal. 164 is only 28,800 bph. Still a lot of stress on the balance wheel.
gatorcpa
This solves it! Thanks for tracking this down.

By aspirational, I mean the price on the tag is $1,400. After Googling, I saw the same price for a different JLC MM on one of the first Google links that pops up when you type in LeCoultre Master Mariner.

However, at this particular thrift store (not a goodwill but very similar) the tag is marked with different colors for certain discounts on certain days. So some days it could be 50% off, so $700. Or it could be 75% off on certain days. It's also possible they'll be open to negotiating further. I found it in a bin with a ton of Seiko quartz and fashion and novelty quartz watches. That's pretty typical, I occasionally see mechanical Seiko or Timex watches at shops like this but never JLC or even Hamilton or Elgin.

I do like the silver linen dial and case shape, though noted your point that it's highly polished and not a desirable movement. I also wonder about the cracked crystal, too, and whether that would be difficult to find a replacement for. Part of considering acquiring this is because the brand is cool, I don't have a linen dial watch and like the 70s cushion case shape. Picking this up at a random thrift store also means something to me, bc I like the story.

I'd like to have it and wear it, with proper servicing, but would also be fine letting it go if I can figure whether it's more likely than not would require a significant overhaul (seems likely given the condition I found it in). I'm planning to give it a second look and check out the movement (I have a rubber ball and loupe). Also hear you on the fact the hrs means that the balance (and I assume pallet fork, right?) experience a lot of stress and replacement parts would be hard to come by.

I know I'm seeing stars a little bit because in my years of digging through junky watches at shops like this, I've never seen something like this. Either way, a fun and unexpected find.
 
Posts
13,095
Likes
17,950
To me, this is a $200 to $300 watch tops. It's going to cost at least that to service, so you'll be $400 to $600 in. People look at the prices of the current JLC lineup and think that these old ones should be priced accordingly, but unless you have one of the special models that collectors crave (Polaris, Deep Sea, etc.), there is no super value here.

Crystals should not be much of an issue with this one. A watchmaker should be able to fit a generic. You might want to try Polywatch first as it doesn't look like it is cracked all the way through.
gatorcpa
 
Posts
118
Likes
202
To me, this is a $200 to $300 watch tops. It's going to cost at least that to service, so you'll be $400 to $600 in. People look at the prices of the current JLC lineup and think that these old ones should be priced accordingly, but unless you have one of the special models that collectors crave (Polaris, Deep Sea, etc.), there is no super value here.

Crystals should not be much of an issue with this one. A watchmaker should be able to fit a generic. You might want to try Polywatch first as it doesn't look like it is cracked all the way through.
gatorcpa
thanks very much for the feedback. appreciate it!
 
Posts
3,742
Likes
10,225
@gatorcpa is completely correct on this one. Even if half off, that watch would still be easily priced at twice what I would be comfortable paying. I would take a pass on it if I were you.
 
Posts
118
Likes
202
@gatorcpa is completely correct on this one. Even if half off, that watch would still be easily priced at twice what I would be comfortable paying. I would take a pass on it if I were you.
appreciate your feedback, will pass! this is why I like going thrifting, you just never know what will turn up
 
Posts
92
Likes
15
I decided to add a bit here since this thread is one of the best resources for this watch I was able to come across. The one I was looking at was similar (see pic) but not a lot out there on this model I could find. I also included a post with some engine info.