GIRARD-PERREGAUX R.A.F. REAR ADMIRAL WATCH

KKBT5168 · Aug 23, 2019

Hello, I have a Girard-Perregaux and would like to know more about the background of it. The Museum Curator from Girard-Perregaux (GP), a division of SOWIND SA, replied that no doubt that the watch is authentic. Unfortunately, the number engraved on the case back does not correspond to those of their files. So he cannot give me an exact info. However, as obviously the watch has especially been produced for the Royal Air Force (RAF), it is possible that it received a special numbering. After the design and the movement (no shock absorber), he should say that it dates back to the late 1940’s. He checked in his files again he did not find any track of a document between GP and RAF. He added that it may be possible that this business was organized by their former agent. Your input is much appreciated.

KKBT5168 · Aug 23, 2019

And I had written on to RAFA to seek their help to direct me to the party whom can help me.

JimInOz · Aug 23, 2019

I don't know of any Rear Admirals (it's a Naval rank) who served with the Royal Air Force.

I suspect a fanciful re-dial.

KKBT5168 · Aug 23, 2019

JimInOz
I don't know of any Rear Admirals (it's a Naval rank) who served with the Royal Air Force.

I suspect a fanciful re-dial.

Thanks for your input. I was skeptical at first thus I wrote to GP to enquire. The reply from the Museum Curator was comforting but incomplete thus I am trying to seek input from this platform.

stuart70 · Aug 23, 2019

I tend to agree about being a re-dial.

However, Sir Matthew Slattery was both in the RAF and the Royal Navy in the 1930’s. In WW1 he was in the Fleet Air Arm which was part of the RAF at that time. He retired at the rank of Rear Admiral in 1948.

With these sort of things provenance is key. You can usually get people to match the limited facts. Anyway good luck with your search.

KKBT5168 · Aug 23, 2019

S stuart70
I tend to agree about being a re-dial.

However, Sir Matthew Slattery was both in the RAF and the Royal Navy in the 1930’s. In WW1 he was in the Fleet Air Arm which was part of the RAF at that time. He retired at the rank of Rear Admiral in 1948.

With these sort of things provenance is key. You can usually get people to match the limited facts. Anyway good luck with your search.

Thank you for your valuable information. This is the kind of data that I will never have accessed to.

gatorcpa · Aug 23, 2019

I would be very wary of this watch. There are a few things that make me question the authenticity.

1. The GP logo on the caseback looks to be laser etched. This technique didn’t exist in the 1940’s. Here is a typical example of a GP logo from that era on a watch I believe to be genuine.

The logo on the OP watch looks nothing like this. I think it was added many years later.

2. Movement markings. Here the the movement from the same watch.

Not that the name of the company is Gerard Perregaux & Co. on this example. There is also a “serial” number, which is really a combination of the caliber and production run information. The OP watch is missing both.

Here is a picture of the dial with a totally different logo, and eBay closed listing for this particular watch.

https://m.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Girard-Perregaux-Military-Watch-Sea-Hawk-WW2-outer-24hr-sector-dial/153558515072

I would stay away from this one. Too many spider senses tingling here, regardless of what GP says.
gatorcpa

Tony C. · Aug 23, 2019

Franken. No way that case back is legit.

KKBT5168 · Aug 23, 2019

gatorcpa
I would be very wary of this watch. There are a few things that make me question the authenticity.

1. The GP logo on the caseback looks to be laser etched. This technique didn’t exist in the 1940’s. Here is a typical example of a GP logo from that era on a watch I believe to be genuine.

The logo on the OP watch looks nothing like this. I think it was added many years later.

2. Movement markings. Here the the movement from the same watch.

Not that the name of the company is Gerard Perregaux & Co. on this example. There is also a “serial” number, which is really a combination of the caliber and production run information. The OP watch is missing both.

Here is a picture of the dial with a totally different logo, and eBay closed listing for this particular watch.

https://m.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Girard-Perregaux-Military-Watch-Sea-Hawk-WW2-outer-24hr-sector-dial/153558515072

I would stay away from this one. Too many spider senses tingling here, regardless of what GP says.
gatorcpa

Thank you for your time and effort to enlighten me on the watch. Unfortunately, this watch is mine and I would have to live with it. Really appreciate your detail analysis.

KKBT5168 · Aug 23, 2019

Tony C.
Franken. No way that case back is legit.

Thank you for your input on the case back.

JimInOz · Aug 24, 2019

S stuart70
I tend to agree about being a re-dial.

However, Sir Matthew Slattery was both in the RAF and the Royal Navy in the 1930’s. In WW1 he was in the Fleet Air Arm which was part of the RAF at that time. He retired at the rank of Rear Admiral in 1948.

With these sort of things provenance is key. You can usually get people to match the limited facts. Anyway good luck with your search.

In WW1 he would have been in the RNAS (Royal Naval Air Service), not the FAA.

That is, if he had been old enough, but as he was only a very young teenager and spent most of his early Naval career undergoing training as a Midshipman his WW1 period of service was mostly pens, pencils and parades.

Although he was attached to the RAF at various times during his service with the FAA, he was still a Naval officer and held RAF equivalent rank during those attachments.

While there were many cross service attachments, especially during the lead up and during WW2, I am unaware of any Rear Admiral serving in the RAF.

Thanks for the prompt, it was interesting to research his history, which inevitably led to half a day spent doing nothing instead of searching for watches on the internet 😁.

Cheers
Jim

(ex RAN Fleet Air Arm, ex RAAF, various attachments to Australian Army aviation squadrons).

KKBT5168 · Aug 24, 2019

JimInOz
In WW1 he would have been in the RNAS (Royal Naval Air Service), not the FAA.

That is, if he had been old enough, but as he was only a very young teenager and spent most of his early Naval career undergoing training as a Midshipman his WW1 period of service was mostly pens, pencils and parades.

Although he was attached to the RAF at various times during his service with the FAA, he was still a Naval officer and held RAF equivalent rank during those attachments.

While there were many cross service attachments, especially during the lead up and during WW2, I am unaware of any Rear Admiral serving in the RAF.

Thanks for the prompt, it was interesting to research his history, which inevitably led to half a day spent doing nothing instead of searching for watches on the internet 😁.

Cheers
Jim

(ex RAN Fleet Air Arm, ex RAAF, various attachments to Australian Army aviation squadrons).

You did not do nothing. In fact you had learned more about the history of him. As to why my watch had the inscription of R.A.F. and Rear Admiral will remain a mystery. It makes no sense for the person to re-dial it this way as it will clearly raise a lot of suspicion from others who know obviously that the Airforce does not have such Navy rank. If only we can ask Sir Matthew Slattery if it was to commemorate the Last Flight in Royal Air Force Service on May 3rd 1977 where he signed off as Rear Admiral.